The Open bet - help required

Money is always the greatest motivator for strategy and decisions ,and even more so for business-there should be no surprise there!

Please can you tell me where you got your rose tinted glasses and the stuff you are smoking Jack. :S

With respect - If you can't see problems change the prescription of the glasses mate. Where have you been during the 1612 posts you have put in this forum. Have you not read what is being said here. The industry according to ab clanners is bereft of any thing but big problems (in the most part). But besides those opinions just consider what is actually happening around you currently, what has happened historically and what is about to transpire in the future. If you can't discern problems or see the dangerously choppy strait that the game is in, then I'm not sure how we can debate the matter further.

Agree to disagree I suppose.

abacus Wrote:

---

> Please can you tell me where you got your rose
> tinted glasses and the stuff you are smoking Jack.
> :S
>
> With respect - If you can't see problems change
> the prescription of the glasses mate. Where have
> you been during the 1612 posts you have put in
> this forum. Have you not read what is being said
> here. The industry according to ab clanners is
> bereft of any thing but big problems
>
> Agree to disagree I suppose.

I suppose. But Phumelela posted R110 million profit most recent accounting, so they not in trouble. Tellytrack made a few million profit last cycle, they not in trouble. Stables are full. In the 1990's a racing yard had about 40 horses and a big yard about 80. Now yards are 100 and 150 sometimes, and yet they get subsidies. No shortage of horses to buy. Horses have opportunities to run, many races can't get an 11th horse to try. I have owned plenty shares in horses with loads of partners, never has one complained about stakes and they came from a range of wealth brackets.

Things change: 15 years ago I sold 2 unraced 2yo on the phone in half an hour for 40K each, after buying lucerne for R9/bale. 15 years later lucerne was R60 but those horses would be maybe 70K and not 250K in line with costs.

A horse in training is freakishly expensive. but so is a new car, and the petrol to power it. So are school fees and medical insurance. But owning a racehorse is out there with owning a sports car or a holiday home.

When people say something is in crisis, it's not unreasonable to ask what exactly? CT not able to break square for 5 years is a problem, but someone paid and there are still subsidies, so the truth is maybe it's just a loss leader for an industry. The first time you lose 6 mill is a crisis. 5 consecutive years later (is that what they said on the Tellytrack show?) its something else, but I wouldn't know what.

Earlier Rob Faux pointed out that money is the great motivator.

Jack, ultimately you and I will always disagree on this one. To me the open bet is morally wrong and is open theft from the industry. Not negotiable.
Rob, lets not call the open bet "legally fair" when same legal decision was based upon the laws of the Govt and the stooges at Gaming Board.... Any and every avenue available should be used to counteract the situation. That's where I stand.

Abacus, you can coat me if u like - I cannot believe that we can condone the robbery of racings own turnover, then twist it to look like its racing's fault and then encourage racing to compromise, by giving commission or a better deal to those who are robbing it.

Bobsmith - your ignorance shines through ! Go and find out what school I went to, what language I speak at home, what school my son attended etc. And I would have loved you to call me Afrikaans and Broederbond in front of my late paternal grandmother who was born in Scotland.... And yes, I am fully bilingual and yes, English and Afrikaans are not the only languages that I speak. And NO, my posts are not in Afrikaans, not normally. Maar as dit nodig is dan sal ek in Afrikaans skryf, want ek KAN !

louisg Wrote:

---

> Jack, ultimately you and I will always disagree on
> this one. To me the open bet is morally wrong and
> is open theft from the industry. Not negotiable.
> Rob, lets not call the open bet "legally fair"
> when same legal decision was based upon the laws
> of the Govt and the stooges at Gaming Board....
> Any and every avenue available should be used to
> counteract the situation. That's where I stand.
>
> Abacus, you can coat me if u like - I cannot
> believe that we can condone the robbery of racings
> own turnover, then twist it to look like its
> racing's fault and then encourage racing to
> compromise, by giving commission or a better deal
> to those who are robbing it.
>
> Bobsmith - your ignorance shines through ! Go and
> find out what school I went to, what language I
> speak at home, what school my son attended etc.
> And I would have loved you to call me Afrikaans
> and Broederbond in front of my late paternal
> grandmother who was born in Scotland.... And yes,
> I am fully bilingual and yes, English and
> Afrikaans are not the only languages that I speak.
> And NO, my posts are not in Afrikaans, not
> normally. Maar as dit nodig is dan sal ek in
> Afrikaans skryf, want ek KAN !

Your argument about what is legal is beyond belief.........the case "set" the law .......it created precedence.............it was appealed and failed.
(I have been told by legal people involved that the Operators case was very badly handled .............and failing to convince a judge that a "tote" bet is not, in principle, a fixed price product,would tend to confirm)
The right to further appeal has been denied.
Why are you letting this issue make a fool of you???
Whether you personally accept the judgement is of no concern to anyone but yourself...........in the real world it exists!

So you go with your govt and their squeaky clean legal process. You clearly love it. That's your prerogative and then maybe you the fool, here.

Because, legally, overseas racing must be paid for if bookies want it and if not, no feed. Sorry for you. Then you must accept it too, as it would be completely legal to do that. And if you don't accept the legality thereof and that it exists, then you the fool, like me.X(

louisg Wrote:

---

> So you go with your govt and their squeaky clean
> legal process. You clearly love it. That's your
> prerogative and then maybe you the fool, here.
>
> Because, legally, overseas racing must be paid for
> if bookies want it and if not, no feed. Sorry for
> you. Then you must accept it too, as it would be
> completely legal to do that. And if you don't
> accept the legality thereof and that it exists,
> then you the fool, like me.X(

Your argument makes 3 short planks seem like a computer!!!!

as does your response

Louis you didn't comment on the facts that Bob raised about betting world being bookmakers and the fact that all reference to betting fixed odds on the channel pushes only betting world

louisg Wrote:

---

> So you go with your govt and their squeaky clean
> legal process. You clearly love it. That's your
> prerogative and then maybe you the fool, here.
>
> Because, legally, overseas racing must be paid for
> if bookies want it and if not, no feed. Sorry for
> you. Then you must accept it too, as it would be
> completely legal to do that. And if you don't
> accept the legality thereof and that it exists,
> then you the fool, like me.X(

Louis,I have to ask you to explain this statement:

You say "your govt"..........is your and my govt not the same?
the "squeaky clean legal process" is hardly relevant as this was a civil action ,with both parties presenting their cases and the court giving judgement..............unless you suggesting there was undue influence.
the tellytrack pictures were not part of that judgement and is a separate issue but am amused at the "sorry for you " comment.....why sorry for me ..........sorry for Bookmakers perhaps!!!!!
You are letting your emotions use comments which make no sense!.

And you make sense ? hahahahaha

Simple question Rob - are you FOR or AGAINST the open bet ?