Stallions in South Africa

FC Wrote:

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> I had a foreign partner in a horse...he is a
> breeder and owner in the UK...he told me that SA
> horses are not well bred per say...foreigners buy
> SA horses on confirmation and not on
> breeding...maybe the experts can further
> elaborate.

?.....generally speaking your partner may be right......our years of isolation did us no favours and the imports were largely haphazzard ......our mare bands are devoid of American influences until the penny dropped causing a disproportionate ratio in the MrProspector Bold Ruler mix......we landed up with far too many sons of Mr P and too few of good sons of BR.......a lot more Jungle Cove types were needed......now we are over the top with sires with far too much American influences that seek a foundation of the same in the mares.

We only find the few gems in the imports of these obscure pedigrees that the late Mr Beck
Imported and produced horses like Soft Falling Rain and producedJackson

Muhti, what I wonder is, how "exceptions" like these will do at stud. They stand out personally from a generally poor-class background, but which genes will be passed on - the good ones or the poor ones? What is their track record in the breeding shed, do you know?

I am certainly on Elmer's page as far as Kahal is concerned. A few of those juicy mares from Highlands ,Maine chance etal ...we can only imagine what he might have done

Mavourneen Wrote:

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> Muhti, what I wonder is, how "exceptions" like
> these will do at stud. They stand out personally
> from a generally poor-class background, but which
> genes will be passed on - the good ones or the
> poor ones? What is their track record in the
> breeding shed, do you know?

SFR is some what of a miracle....... if you disect his pedigree his sire National Assembly was unraced and at the end of his glorious breeding career and the imported dam is only a 1 time winner.....the dam tail line was crying out for Danzig + BR which it got in one shot.

He should do much better than many of the other sons of National Assembly that went to stud. However locally his ideal local mare band have not been born/bred yet. He will click with the multiples of future A P Indy types, love the Kingmambo and Macheveillian influences in mares

I may add that this one sire fits all notion that we inhereted during our period of isolation is a traditional shotgun approach,using the numbers game in sending large bands of mares to so called super sires will get you a hand full of champions and fifty times more also rans...... matings have to be planned to breed the best.....:S

What is your opinion on Lateral? He seems to have a bit of a different pedigree
to the other SA bunch Stands at a top stud and probably imported to follow up on their
top stallion Silvano

elmer Wrote:

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> What is your opinion on Lateral? He seems to have
> a bit of a different pedigree
> to the other SA bunch Stands at a top stud and
> probably imported to follow up on their
> top stallion Silvano

With all due respect to the the stud at which he stands.....he should have stayed in Germany....he will never be anything close to Silvano.... please read the article in the SP as to tracing sire lines in connection to Silvano.....Lateral has very little affinities with the population of mares in the area in which he stands.....now with the glut of American influences in the area the suitable dams for him will be like hens teeth..... he may get a good mating by chance but the odds are not in his favour....:S

Muhti ,I ask because I don't know.I see they are both Northern Drancer line
Can you elaborate as to why you think Lateral won't have success OK Silvano
would be a hard act to follow,but what I like is the the German stallions unlike American
or Uk have not raced on lasix so you know they are probably not bleeders.

The only thing against Lateral is his size. I have seen a few of his babies and trust me there is a lot to like. He will have to, like all other Maine Chance stallions, do it the hard way. They don`t over market their horses, like others that pray on naive dreamers, with their distorted stats. He is a great match for Jet Master mares.

Judpot, Sail from Seatle and Oratorio made exciting starts.

Stallions for the Future: Querari and Gimmethegreenlight (Soft falling rain?)

elmer Wrote:

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> Muhti ,I ask because I don't know.I see they are
> both Northern Drancer line
> Can you elaborate as to why you think Lateral
> won't have success OK Silvano
> would be a hard act to follow,but what I like is
> the the German stallions unlike American
> or Uk have not raced on lasix so you know they are
> probably not bleeders.

The reason for Silvano being head and shoulders above most is the perfect balance of breed between American influences and best of European genes......he has BR in the damline making him receptive to mares of Mr Prospector Northern Dancer and if you can still find them Bold Ruler......Lateral is limited in dimention in that his best mating mares are in Europe he needs Darshaan Mill Reef Dominion Derring Do Tankero influences which were once popular here. He may do OK with Mr P in Kingmambo and kin of Nureyev

Muhtiman Wrote:

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> elmer Wrote:
>

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>

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> > What is your opinion on Lateral? He seems to
> have
> > a bit of a different pedigree
> > to the other SA bunch Stands at a top stud and
> > probably imported to follow up on their
> > top stallion Silvano
>
> With all due respect to the the stud at which he
> stands.....he should have stayed in Germany....he
> will never be anything close to Silvano.... please
> read the article in the SP as to tracing sire
> lines in connection to Silvano.....Lateral has
> very little affinities with the population of
> mares in the area in which he stands.....now with
> the glut of American influences in the area the
> suitable dams for him will be like hens teeth.....
> he may get a good mating by chance but the odds
> are not in his favour....:

I would love to know ,
Why does outcross mating (hybrid vigour ) not work in a racehorse ?

gg Wrote:

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:
>
> I would love to know ,
> Why does outcross mating (hybrid vigour ) not work
> in a racehorse ?

Who says it dosn't .........outcrossing and not repeating the multiples of ND and Mr P will save the breed..... that is why it is essential to cross the major lines ND Mr P and BR to get better performers......the modern day outcross is to mate ND to no ND BR and Mr P and use the examples that I suggested in mating with Lateral

I thought this post was about me!! got that one by the proverbials ..