The Graeme Hawkins Interview On Tellytrack

For the record, I have never said the open bet is good for racing. I have merely remarked that it is legal in response to a poster's remark in another thread that he would give "offenders six months to change their ways" or words to that effect.

Like it or not, bookmakers who lay open bets are not offenders. That may change at some point in the future, but for now can we not just get used to the idea?

ja magiclips. ja. sorry did not now you were adios's guru.

impartiality does not come from you

hawkins was asked about the rumour goingaround regarding graham beck buying phumelela...anybody know anything about this

The open bet problem was created by Gold Circle and Phumelela themselves.They took the decision along time ago to limit the bet to R6.00 and no less.This effectively stopped all the poor people from having bets in racing.They them made it even harder for the poor to bet by insisting that they MUST use betmark cards and no verbal bets are allowed.But you can take a lotto for R2.50 and play slots for 10c a line.The fact that the bookmakers lay open bets is legal and 3% of the tax generated by winning open bets goes to Gold Cicle/Phumelela anyway.Betting World which today owns about 20% of all the bookmaker outlets doesnot lay the open bet so have their turnovers gone up by over 20% to prove what the open bet figure is in terms of turnover because its only a guess.As far as i know all turnovers in bookmaking and with the tote outlets are stagnant so any figures quoted are pie in the sky guesses.If outlets like Hollywood have seen the gap to target the open bet dont blame them,they have seen the gap and are good for racing.

Pirates,

There is talk of Beck spending up to 650 million to get a majority share holding in Phumelela.

What did Hawkins say by the way?Haven't seen the interview.

As far as i know G.Beck has bequeathed to Gold Circle/Phumelela a large sum of money on his death +100million on his death on condition they merge but the capital can not be distributed to stop ,the interest can be used for racing purposes.It is all hearsay no one knows the true facts except Mr Beck.

whitehouse your statement that people like hollywood taking the open bet is good for racing is misleading. the answer is included in your statement where you say that 3% on winning bets is payed over to P/GC "anyway"

If these same self bets were on the tote, the payment would be a minimum of 25% on ALL bets. There can be no doubt that the open bet is not good for south african racing. It can only be good for the bookmakers that lay these

Mad Mike..
think we must move the focus to the bookmakers...

the current bookmaker clans are not strong enough...
all 104 current GOBA members with their present value are not equal to the gold ring past value, of the 1980's, which had only about 40 bookmakers..

the goldring had no overheads and fancy venues...
a box, umbrella (which they nicked during one of the sponsored races), 2 boards, clip board for the payout clerk, and a leather bag...oh and a pencil..

you could ask any one in the goldring for R10k of a horse, R20K - 90 % of the ring, R50K from at least 20 and R100k from at least 4 bookmakers..

besides this..every town had bookmakers..Nigel- 2...Springs- 5..carletonville -2 ..westonaria -1...


today..some have many venues..ranging from restaurant environment to airport terminal lounge..

walked in at mosselbay dec 2007...asked R20k of the double...no bet..headoffice must ok it...multiple franchise...

which bookmaker is going to lay you R100k or R200k, every race, when they start loading...
I know..stood on the track..
the owners came to me for bets..
laid them whatever they wanted..they could not get on with their bookmakers...
and I could not get it back at any of the bookmakers..
just lucky..never got caught...

owner of itchy finger..
wanted R66k to R2k win...and R20k to R2k place...first timer..
he got the bet...u think these franchises would lay me back R30k...
the horse ran 5 or 6th

next time out he took R32K to R2K and R10k to R2k a place..
same story..ran 4 or 5th..

the next time..vaal sand..I did not stand...
he stuck them out..
tuesday settling..they were cursing me... I took his money..but they must pay..

laid many bets like that..
my ex wife has got more that the whole lot together...



the point is...we are debating an open bet with bookmakers...what R10 bets..

Dont forget that the province gets 3% also of the tax generated,also the bookmaker is paying all the expeneses of laying the bet ,staff,computers ,rent etc.It is common knowledge that it costs about 7/8 % of the turnover to run a branch ,but the big question is why did the tote operators decide to tell the poor punters to go to hell and leave it to the bookmakers.Dont forget the previous disadvantaged people dont have formal schooling and dont have R6.00 to bet on every race but now they bet on soccer and horses thanks to Hollywood etc but now GC/P want it all their way.Give every bookmaker his own Tote Agency pay a fair commission if it costs GC/P 7% to run a branch it will cost a bookmaker the same so be fair .

whitehouse..

before that tab pays a bookmaker 7%...they will rather install tab machines in shebeens with sab accounts and pay them 7%...

the previously dissadvantaged punters are in the shebeen..

the days of the bookmakers have been...and are gone...bet exchanges like interbet and betfair will replace them..

the bookmaker industry is built on credit and make belief..

common sense tells you...a cash punter gets beter odds from interbet..
only the punters that punt on credit, punt with bookmakers..taking a lesser price..

what does a bookmaker offer better than interbet/tote......credit...

that's why the bookmaking industry is built on make belief..

answer this...if 2 bookmakers fold for R500k each..how many others will fold with them...the entire system..

ps... any one that takes an open bet (on credit) with a boomaker must surely have lost their mind...dont they have this guy after every race broadcasting...the tote pays 2/1...the bookmakers pays 7/2...

Graeme used to work for Phumelela. since he left the wheels have come off.