Dave Mollet ! Who does he think he is ?

Guys if you go to facebook it is really easy to make a group - Take up the challenge and form one I'm sure if you get enough members you will be noticed - I'm unfortunately far too busy with other endeavours but I'm sure Mister A would really be the man for the job
www.facebook.com/home.php#/group.php?gid=103171430800 this is an example of a group that I have created regarding young owners. Please feel free to join this group if you think you have any ideas etc or would like to participate in the proposed race day

I support this as well...the bookmakers have far too much control in SA..either allow international cos in or get govt to ban bookmaking altogether!

These guys have nobody watching them or controlling them..its unacceptable

oscar Wrote:

---

> I support this as well...the bookmakers have far
> too much control in SA..either allow international
> cos in or get govt to ban bookmaking altogether!
>
> These guys have nobody watching them or
> controlling them..its unacceptable


Amen, brother!

Name a country outside of England where bookmakers reign supreme and where racing still continues to flourish. It is a camcer pm tje s[prt amd certaom death.

Have to disagree, need all options open to the punters, you are aware of my feelings with a tote only monopoly. "blind betting" in many cases.

We need bookies for fixed price,plus doubles and trebles etc.

We need the tote for exotics.

We need exchanges, for best price on individual bets.

imo

Considering that most if not all of the most affluent racing jurisdictions in the world are Tote monopolies I cannot but feel that, in principle, this nonsense that fixed odds provide valuable guidance to punters is completely overblown. Indeed, fixed odds market moves are so seldom accurate that I truly cannot understand what is supposedly so bloody awful about "blind" Totes.

That said, I can only repeat that in my opinion the time when SA racing could even consider turning itself into a Tote monopoly is long gone. It's no longer a case of Tote v bookmaker, but racing v other gambling forms.

Morning Magic, when I refer to "blind totes" its the markets for the "local" SA punters betting on overseas markets, where a R1000 win can make a horse money on fav and mislead the punters in the totes into thinking a hot fav is in the race.
The co-mingling was the way around this, but we appear to have made a disaster there?

e.g. when Dettori won on a 6/1 shot in France it started 11/10 R2.10 on the tote and was NOT the tote fav (can dig out the post if required).

Have many examples on the site, have chosen the one below.
From my point of view, will never take the tote over a bookmaker/exchange when punting.
From a financial perspective, being a small time owner, the minimal increase in a stakes cheque versus the return on a bet, is a no contest.
The fact that the Japs were able to make a mockery of the ARC (the biggest race on the planet?) via tote bets.
The betting public have to have a choice and not be dictated to or threatened.
Betting on "blind totes" with no form or proper betting markets imo is a disgrace.


Re: Co-migling - bigger pools = bigger dividends..!!! (?)
Posted by: scotia ()
Date: April 22, 2008 09:33AM


This is one of my pet hates, and can find plenty more on this subject, but don't be conned!!

CO-MINGLING?


Note! This was an extract from an early Scotia in the morning posts with regards to the co-mingling French fiasco????????????????????????????????????




I also posted on the site with regards the 2 horse race, makes its so much easier to check what pressure the normal "punter" is up against, I posted PLEASE don't make them both "money-on", however blackpearl at 7/10 and 11/10 tried to come to the party, Interbet at racetime came to the party in-line with Betfair with 8/10 and 12/10 at 100%, but the early prices from the bookies at 6/10 and 9/10 shocking, but the shocker was the TOTE with 7/10 the winner and "NOT TOTE FAV", this must surely expose to the poor punter in the tote how much the "rip off" factor is. I will say this one more time as it totally infuriates me that the French co-mingling fiasco when Dettori won on the 6/1 shot and it paid 11/10 on the tote and "WAS NOT THE TOTE FAV", just wish more people could read these posts on the site, and after my inputs on Saturday, many people do read the site, but don't post

SA bookies need more competition or Govt needs to ban the practise..things change in life and the time has come for them to up their game or get out!!

Someone needs to make a presentation to the gambling board on this.

Oscar..sorry mate in curious what exactly are you refering to when you say competition ?

International firms like betfair , ladbrokes etc..these local guys are like a club mate..what I cannot fathom out is with all the bookies we have in SA ..I dont know how many we have..lets say 40??..if a person backs a horse to win R25k which means each bookie stands to lose R600.00 if they each took a slice then the horse shortens to half its odds..its a joke.

am a bit dismayed that jonk'se seems to have been beaten up so badly on this thread, when really all he's saying is that the punter's only pleasure in life is getting the stretch from his bookie.

in truth Molly is agreeing with you mate when he says the stretch should be available to all punters, not just those that are savvy enough to negotiate for it. the fact that the price advertised is not the price available goes a long way to explaining why racing finds it so f&^%ing hard to attract and retain newcomers who want to have a bet.

and to magic/oscar/Barry's comments the global reality seems to be that racing struggles year after year to keep up with the other things that people want to gamble on. the countries where racing is still profitable is not just because there are no bookmakers - it's because aside from lottery (150% risk-free book, anyone?) it is the only form of legal gambling at all. most of them get government protection.

but those monopolies still face increasing levels of borderless competition from the internet and mobile technology. the longer they hide behind the skirts of government protection the harder it will be when they eventually have to face up to the need to behave competitively to retain their punters, rather than arrogantly.

that's my tuppence-worth.

The simple equation for successful horse racing is as follows:

Punters wager on a race. They bet amongst themselves.

The Tote, for providing structure for the bet, takes a slice of the action.

There are three partners (entities) equally splitting this slice, as follows:

Tote: one third.

Racing club: one third.

Prize money: one third.

As long as enough money is wagered through the tote, everybody thrives.

But when bookies take wagering funds and don't return a fair share to the racing club or the prize money accounts, the sport is sucked dry.

Everytime somebody makes a bet with a bookie, they are hurting the sport.

The formula works.