Is there a problem at the Academy?

Ok so let's assume that in some debauched way it is ok to hit kids if they don't behave. Do you then also hit your dog and your horse if they don't behave? Do you hit your wife and your elderly mother if they don't behave? Do you go around hitting people in the streets too? Or is it just defenseless kids that are ok to be hit? Where is the line drawn?

Using fear and the threat of violence to exert control over others is archaic and sickening. There are far more evolved ways to achieve balance in life and those who believe violence is the only way need to start thinking past their own regressive urges. Let's try and embrace the fact that we have evolved to a state of existence where violence is figuratively vestigial.

well said Leon,there is a massive difference between discipline and discipline with violence...

So I know nothing about what is happening at Summerveld but let me ask this.

What is Pukman talking about? Is he referring to appies sorting each other out with a klap and a scuffle here and there or are you guys talking about corporal punishment dished out by the riding masters or the people in charge of where these boys live????

I mean, you are never going to stop young boys who live together and compete on a daily basis from getting into it. It is their right of passage to becoming a man. I got moered more times than I care to remember when I was at school and when I grew up, found the gym and I started doing the moering.....it is how boys grow up.

Having said that if we are talking about the authority figures beating the kids up........That is a big no, no. There are much more effective ways of punishment and you don't have to lift your hands at the kids. In fact I believe it is not legal for an authority figure to dish out corporal punishment???? I mean, come on, are we still living in the 70's and 80's? Do you guys really think our jocks are worse or better because of how many cuts they got with a cane or plank or hockey stick???

Just a little perspective is needed here methinks...............

Nature is normally right and look at a pride of lions,a pack of hyena's, a troop of baboons etc and see that when someone steps out of place a swift klap or nip sorts the youngster or trouble causer out. It is the threat of getting caned 6 of the best that is worse than the actual act. A bit like Russia and USA both having huge amounts of nuclear weapons that they would most probably never use against each other but the threat is there so they dont. My Dad used to hit me on the backside with his open hand and it has done me no harm at all as far as I know and I would not have had it any other way. My neutered dog pees on the back of my couch and the door is open and I catch him doing it, must I give him a quick smack on the bum or keep him in detention or take his food and water away?:S This world has become a strange place, they/we want freedom and be able to say and do what we think but the Government now wants to come into our homes and dictate that we cannot do what my Dad did to me in my own home????????????????.:S

Lsetaro Wrote:

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> Ok so let's assume that in some debauched way it
> is ok to hit kids if they don't behave. Do you
> then also hit your dog and your horse if they
> don't behave? Do you hit your wife and your
> elderly mother if they don't behave? Do you go
> around hitting people in the streets too? Or is it
> just defenseless kids that are ok to be hit? Where
> is the line drawn?
>
> Using fear and the threat of violence to exert
> control over others is archaic and sickening.
> There are far more evolved ways to achieve balance
> in life and those who believe violence is the only
> way need to start thinking past their own
> regressive urges. Let's try and embrace the fact
> that we have evolved to a state of existence where
> violence is figuratively vestigial.

that is a modern view which I agree with - It amazes me that people think children need violence and the threat of it to behave "normally "- I bet if you visit the homes of the children that are "uncontrollable" you will find parents that have little or no interest in their children. To expect teachers or academy masters to inflict corporal punishment on a child is wrong. Suicide/ drug abuse are the results of a problematic home life be that at the academy(perhaps the stress of riding etc) or the child's physical home. I received many a caning at school and it took me years to find out why I did certain things which were wrong so the caning did nothing except make me resent authority instead of respecting it.

S good friend of mine was having problems with his growing up school kids just after 1994 who refused to take orders or assist in the house with cleaning up etc. ...''it was their right!'

So, one day, he shut the front gate, locked front and back doors, downed the windows, sat in front of the TV with the volume set high enough not to disturb the neighbours.

The two kids came from school...gate locked?? They jumped over the fence and knocked on the door. No response! Louder! Then, to the windows, knocking and screaming 'Dad! Dad!'

The father stay put...watching TV!

With all the noise, a neighbour or two came out....no luck! Call the police? Maybe something happened? Very unlikely of dad not to be at home and open the door?

About 2 hours later (and very hungry 2 kids later), dad peeps through the curtains and sees the mob. He comes out and addresses the (whilst they look on, anger and amazement double-edged) 'What the f... are you people doing in my yard? Don't you respect other people's rights? Who gave you the right to jump over my fence? This is my property...my house; now, f off before I have you all arrested!' The neighbours (rather incredulous!), left promptly!

The kids then made to enter the house; he stopped them!
'No! No! this is my house! You see that fence, from there, all that is mine.....I have a right as to who enters and leaves; not you or anyone else!'

'But dad, we are you children!'

'Yeh? I am your father; like you, I also have my rights!'

To cut it short, he spelt out the 10+ commandments; 'you live in my house according to my rules ..or get out; and stay out!'

From that day, he remains No.1 with his kids and the neighbourhood. Both his children are now professionals, married... and have kids of their own!

I doubt if there is a discipline problem in those homes.....do you?

Today Friday 11 October 2013, Malala Yousafzai, the 16yo girl that was shot by the Taliban for campaigning for equal education for boys and girls at school is nominated to win a Nobel Peace Prize. Hopefully she wins. Her take in corporal punishment would definitely be a no no. To get something done the correct way violence is not needed amomgst the youth. There is a difference between a teacher smacking you and your parent. The teacher smacking you will leave you bitter and full of hatred while a parent smacking you for the right reasons doesnt leave you with any grudges. In the end I don't think hitting a kid is right for them to obtain perfection in what you teaching them.

Not related to this specific subject but if my granny used to hear or watch about a terrible crime she would look over her glasses and say " hanging is too good for these bastards, it's a good kick up the arse they need"

i am a parent....and i tell u..when u buy an appliance...it comes with a manual...of how best to install it and what to do when there r problems...pity god didnt send a manual down at birth...lol...but i think every child needs to be treated differently..and at each stage ..achild needs to be treated differently...but 1 thing that all children have is to test boundaries..and see how far they can get away with....its at this junction
that u need to set the boundaries....the earlier in life u set the boundaries the easier it becomes later..so a clip on the ear at a young age..should set them straight...and slowly ease off them into other ways of punishment later...a 3 year old wont understand explanation...but he will understand his bad behaviour with y he is not getting candy...when his brother is getting it...i tell u...parenting...has to be THE most testing job in the world....but the rewards can be great

bloodshot Wrote:

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> Txs for that Titch but I'm still waiting for that
> pot that all the Durban boys have been threatening
> to buy ! Nobody at Marshalls Umhlanga or club Tab
> anymore what's up ?


Marshalls busy with renovations I was at Club tab yesterday with Dave Safi

its the senior apprentices that do the smacking not the teachers get it right and the teachers have no idea of what goes on behind closed doors.

pukman Wrote:

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> its the senior apprentices that do the smacking
> not the teachers get it right and the teachers
> have no idea of what goes on behind closed doors.

A certain now work-rider, ex appy, will tell you differently