Bleeders the cause and what to do?

hibernia Wrote:

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> Lasix to be banned at the Breeders Cup,2yos this
> year and everyone from next year

Interesting! I did wonder if the Americans would sluk the bitter pill down or spit it out. Certainly if they want high-class international competition at the Breeders Cup races they needed to level the playing field ... overseas players were faced with the unpleasant moral choice whether to use drugs on their horses or refuse them ... possibly at the cost of winning. The USA authorities could either ban Lasix at the BC, or weigh all the horses before and after they got dosed and put the balance into the saddlebags (wouldn't that have caused a fuss! Weight loss due to urination runs at approx 2.4% body mass, about 12 kg for a 500 kg horse).

and it will make for some VERY interesting betting. It may be that some hotshot horses aren't all that hot after all ... and that some lesser lights (local or overseas) unexpectedly appear at the top of the results board. The results may be revealing as to what horses are genuinely good and which are propped up on drug-crutches, a tribute to the skill of their vet rather than breeder, trainer or jockey. From the punting point of view it'll be a puzzle though.

Banning Lasix would be even more revealing at lower levels than the BC ... hopefully the day will come that we see that too, but the resistance will be fierce from the racing industry ... some affected folks will scream blue murder ... though I am sure the American public and media will welcome it.

There are now natural products that do just as good a job..if not better than for furosemide.

Must say Mav I disagree with you completely....in many aspects of your analysis of the problem..go onto medlinx and call up all the clinicals and you will see why

This was in yesterday's Daily Racing Post ... fleshes out Hibernia's posting for those who are interested:

Breeders' Cup to ban raceday medication in juvenile races
By Matt Hegarty

All horses who are entered in the five Breeders' Cup races for juveniles in 2012 will be prohibited from using the diuretic Lasix on race day to treat bleeding in the lungs under a policy adopted by the Breeders' Cup on Thursday that will lead to the ban of all raceday drugs at the organization's year-end event by 2013, the organization said.

The partial ban in 2012 is the strongest measure to be taken by any organization in North American racing since efforts began earlier this year to roll back the use of raceday drugs in U.S. racing. The rollback has been strongly supported by the Breeders' Cup and other influential industry organizations, including the Jockey Club and the Association of Racing Commissioners International, but horsemen in the United States have resisted.

In a release, the Breeders' Cup said the ban on raceday drugs in 2012 for the juvenile races was the first step in "the implementation of a new policy for all [Breeders' Cup] races in the 2013 event and subsequent events." The Breeders' Cup currently consists of 15 races run over two days with purses totaling $26 million.

According to the Breeders' Cup, the policy was first discussed and "strongly supported" at a meeting of the organization's 48 members on Wednesday. The 13-member board of directors then voted to adopt the policy at a meeting on Thursday in Lexington, Ky., Breeders' Cup said.

Lasix, which is used to treat bleeding in the lungs, is legal to administer on race day in all U.S. racing states and Canadian provinces. Studies have shown that the drug is effective in reducing the frequency and severity of bleeding, but other studies have also shown that horses who are administered Lasix on race day outperform horses who do not receive the drug, introducing questions as to whether the drug enhances performance.

Around the world, no other major racing jurisdiction allows the raceday use of drugs, and many participants in the international racing community have been highly critical of the policies in the United States and Canada. That criticism has dovetailed with an aggressive attempt by Breeders' Cup over the past several years to expand the influence of its event overseas and tap into international wagering markets.

"Given the high level of international participation in our [races] and the increasing support for our nominations programs throughout the global Thoroughbred breeding and racing community, Breeders' Cup feels strongly that the time has come to modify our medication policies to be consistent with international practices," said Tom Ludt, the chairman of the Breeders' Cup, in the release.

Most horses who come from overseas jurisdictions to run in the Breeders' Cup are administered Lasix on race day. Horsemen have said that they did not want to perform at a disadvantage by declining to give their horses the drug. At last year's event at Churchill Downs, all but five of the 163 horses who ran in the 14 races over the two days were administered Lasix.

The five Breeders' Cup races restricted to 2-year-olds are the Juvenile, the Juvenile Fillies, the Juvenile Turf, the Juvenile Fillies Turf, and a new race for 2011, the Juvenile Sprint.

Breeders' Cup has not yet named a host site for the 2012 event, but the organization is considering three tracks: Belmont Park in New York, Churchill Downs in Kentucky, and Santa Anita Park in California. While Lasix is legal to administer on race day in all three states, horses in Kentucky are also allowed to be administered one of three "adjunct bleeding medications" in addition to Lasix on race day. Those drugs would also be banned under the new policy.

Over the past five years, the Breeders' Cup has adopted several policies in advance of state regulators who enforce the sport's rules, including a ban on the non-therapeutic use of anabolic steroids in 2008 and the implementation of an out-of-competition drug-testing program in 2007.

Unless other racing jurisdictions also ban Lasix on race day for the 2012 racing season, the move by Breeders' Cup will present complications for handicappers who may need to consider the impact of taking a horse off Lasix after the horse has been racing and training on the drug. Because Lasix use is so ubiquitous in North American racing - more than 90 percent of all horses receive a raceday injection of the drug - it is exceedingly rare to see a horse taken off the drug while racing.

Oscar, you've got me puzzled ... do you have a website address I can look at? I've checked out Medlinx.com and a few others with rather similar names ... just spelled slightly differently ... and didn't find anything about furosemide/lasix.

Re herbal remedies, the jury is out I think. There's an incredible number and variety of herbal remedies claiming to "help reduce symptoms" of any problem known to man or beast, from wrinkles to cancer ... few of them have been properly tested. Those selling them aren't required to do any testing. This is unlike pharmaceutical products, that have to be strictly (and expensively) checked, both that they work and that they are safe. I'm always wary of claims made by someone trying to sell me something ... Caveat emptor! Let the buyer beware!. Have these alternatives to furosemide been properly tested? If not, you pays your money and you must just tata your chance.

Just watch out, though, that raceday tests don't pick up forbidden drugs in the horses ... there's also NO control over what the manufacturers put into the bottle ... caffeine, alcohol, mercury, something else ... nee, die salesman hy weet nie, hy's net die middelman.

Mav Im not sure if you have subscriptions to the online journals..Ive used a few journal search engines over the years..try Firstword then if you subscribed..all medical..there must be 50 published clinicals on use of furosemide on racehorses..I know there are better natural remedies for a fact..as I had a bad bleeder win 6 races..the one thing they havnt established 100% yet is to what extent does training on furosemide do to the potassium and sodium levels.

what i cant work out is that trainers are using steroids and i have been told by so called TOP trainers that without using them i will put myself out i have asked the vets and they agree in saying they are banned in human racing because they work yet allowed in horse racing!!!!! surely we should ban steroid use like Europe and maybe we may have less bleeders etc how can a trainer have half his yard on steroids and say it is for medical reasons ie he wont eat or is loosing weight if u are caught using steroids in Europe you go to jail and get a criminal record it is a illegal drug yet here it is tollerated and i believe some of the steroids used are illegal here and pushed by the vets, the same with solu delta it is a cortasone injection yet when i asked a nhra vet about it they said much more than a single dose was needed to make a differance so why allow it if it is still picked up in the dope test yet not allowed in europe or UAE having come from uk i have learend so much about drugs etc its actually frightninig.

The use of "steriods" for training is a "myth" here in RSA.....firstly they are far too expensive and then highly detectable when specimens are tested.Steriods fall into different catagories like growth hormone stimulators said to be used by breeders also very expensive and very hard to source. Pure anabolics for muscle and frame building but detectable in system up to 6 weeks so cannot be used for racing as the time that it takes to rid it from the horse the benefits are lost. Then steroidal anti -inflamitories again detectable and have a 7-10day half life in the system so again no bebefit. Then there are natural occuring "physto sterols" from certain herbs and plants often confused as steriods.These do have growth and conditioning benefits and are totally legal with the execpion of devil's claw which is now being banned in some European racing countries.

An age old growth,bulking and conditioning suppliment is gamma oryzanol found in rice bran oil. Normal rice bran oils for human consumption contain about 500-3500ppm of gamma oryzanol, while equine suppliment companies concentrate these to +100 000ppm. These are very expensive and with import costs can land up around R2000 per litre. An ideal product for growth and building bulk would be a dilution of these concentrates into normal rice bran oil to have a product of 7500-10 000ppm and a cost of R150/l which would feed a horse for 6-10 days and have added benefits of omega 3 and 6 and additional traces of vitamin E.

PM for more details

Well i can tell you it is not a MYTH you may ask the nhra vets and they will tell you steroids are allowed for the treatment of sick animals but i find it funny that a trainer can have half his yard or more than that sick on steroids a simple solution would be for the nhra to conduct random tests on trainers which i may add they do but if it is in the vet book it is ok and he is covered but surely in a yard of 20 1 on a steroid would ok maybe it had billary etc but 6 or 10 on it is abuse !!! as it is down as a treatment but you will find these sick horses working and galloping and then running 30 to 40 days after treatment of steroids one only has to look at certain trainers horses to see which ones use them and as with solu delta etc they are given 48 hrs before a race yet nothing is done about it as i have asked and the response was as long as the vet gave it and it is in the vet book you are clear and if you come up postive the trainer takes the wrap not the vet,All i ask is why is there not a blanket ban on steroids full stop like europe if they dont need it to treat there sick horses with it then neither should we.

Treating convelesing horses especially after a bout of billary, with steriods is simply a short cut to bulk condition.These quick cures will be of more detrement in the long run. If this practice is sanctioned by NHRA vets then good luck to them.Trainers allowing this should be avoided. Should I have a horse recovering from billary I would expect it to be spelled and out of racing until the horse is brought back to health and condition without steroidal enhancement.

PS Rapid bulking and rushing for race fitness imo, is just another reason for horses to over exert and lead to other complications like bleeding......:

Well thats my point and it is advocated by the vets !!!! why not put a ban on Steroids then lets see what happens lets put the horse first,you obviously are in the game and for u to say the use is a myth shows me how closed peoples eyes are to the truth or maybe they dont care as long as they get results.

Ernst, people have a choice, the steriods you mention like Solu Delta are "corto" steriods and have anti-inflammitory properties and are not conditioning or bulking product, but steroidal none the less. The choice comes to use a non-steroidal anti-inflammitories if a horse has injured itself but continuosly bombing it with products like Solu Delta as a cure for continuos lameness to keep it racing, is as Hilton Witz has said "holding it together with glue".....:S