Yvette Bremner

Just wondering....which action invokes more anger....the attack on the horses (frequency and numbers affected?) or that these people live in squalor because of corruption/mal administration (numbers affected and number of years).

Hypothetically speaking, if I constantly kick and abuse my dog, and then one day my dog turns on me and bites me, should the dog be the only one put down. But wait, using this scenario would imply that the grooms should have vented their anger at....wait, leave it. Rather stop there.

Asking for a friend.

PS: For the record, both actions are deplorable.

Lionel wrote: Just wondering....which action invokes more anger....the attack on the horses (frequency and numbers affected?) or that these people live in squalor because of corruption/mal administration (numbers affected and number of years).

Hypothetically speaking, if I constantly kick and abuse my dog, and then one day my dog turns on me and bites me, should the dog be the only one put down. But wait, using this scenario would imply that the grooms should have vented their anger at....wait, leave it. Rather stop there.

Asking for a friend.

PS: For the record, both actions are deplorable.

Very easy for me - attacking horses - The people(I should qualify this and say Adults as children may not have this option) being abused have multiple remedies s to extract themselves out of the dilemma- Industrial Action, Legal action, work to rule etc - The fact that these people chose to attack horses shows that they are able to take action albiet misdirected - What could the horses do when attacked? They rely on instinct to survive - Man has the power to reason and there was no rational reason shown in this case - If all the horses were killed would the people have any jobs? As stated by me action should be taken against the trainers that did not utilise the funds correctly - There is nothing wrong with protest but surely there is something wrong with cruelty hence the meaning of the word.

The article may contain several inaccuracies and exaggerations, however the issue of culling cannot just be swept under the carpet. If this is the accepted norm then some owners have no right to call themselves animal lovers. Putting a horse down for humane reasons is understandable, however if it’s purely for financial reasons then it’s an absolute disgrace. Does the breeding industry take into account retirement plans for a crop. Is overbreeding an issue ? With every purchase there should be an obligation to make provisions for retirement of your horse. This should be regulated even with change of ownership.

Its all about perspective Mr H.

Some people are fighting first world problems. Others are fighting to survive.

alterego wrote: The article may contain several inaccuracies and exaggerations, however the issue of culling cannot just be swept under the carpet. If this is the accepted norm then some owners have no right to call themselves animal lovers. Putting a horse down for humane reasons is understandable, however if it’s purely for financial reasons then it’s an absolute disgrace. Does the breeding industry take into account retirement plans for a crop. Is overbreeding an issue ? With every purchase there should be an obligation to make provisions for retirement of your horse. This should be regulated even with change of ownership.

.......the NHRA is supposed to record and then publish every registered thoroughbred death......but I for one are not going through every publication to search if the report of 30 horses are accurate or not....while on the subject.....at least 5 horses at PE sustained horrific injuries from which they may never recover....what of them....with the owner and trainer out of the game....who is going to see that they are nursed and treated...as clearly they were in no condition to race in the next 5-6 months....who is going to take these horses that were cleaved or badly skinned....:huh:

....the horse that was "accidentally" stabbed in February has not yet been raced since....and what of him....:huh:

There is more concern/ outcry about sporadic problems, while brushing aside the chronic ones.

Lionel wrote: Its all about perspective Mr H.

Some people are fighting first world problems. Others are fighting to survive.

It's right there in your wording-fighting-
Labour problems are about Negotiation not fighting. Much more would have been achieved with a strong union taking economic action than a war against defenseless animals. As an example- If I find my wife sleeping with another man should I kill her dog because she loves it or burn down our house rather than take my grievance to a court knowing that the law would be on my side, You can justify murder if It's for a cause but should you?

mr hawaii wrote:

Lionel wrote: Its all about perspective Mr H.

Some people are fighting first world problems. Others are fighting to survive.

It's right there in your wording-fighting-
Labour problems are about Negotiation not fighting. Much more would have been achieved with a strong union taking economic action than a war against defenseless animals. As an example- If I find my wife sleeping with another man should I kill her dog because she loves it or burn down our house rather than take my grievance to a court knowing that the law would be on my side, You can justify murder if It's for a cause but should you?

I agree with you. I'm a man of peace. As I said previously, I disagree with both parties, and their roles in this tragedy.
All I'm saying is that the outcry/outrage should be equally (at least) directed at all of them, and not just the grooms.

One should also bear in mind that the ability to conduct oneself in a rationale manner comes with its limitations as well. Speak to the Senekal farmers. Again, not condoning any violence...just reminding everyone of perspective.

Lionel wrote:

mr hawaii wrote:

Lionel wrote: Its all about perspective Mr H.

Some people are fighting first world problems. Others are fighting to survive.

It's right there in your wording-fighting-
Labour problems are about Negotiation not fighting. Much more would have been achieved with a strong union taking economic action than a war against defenseless animals. As an example- If I find my wife sleeping with another man should I kill her dog because she loves it or burn down our house rather than take my grievance to a court knowing that the law would be on my side, You can justify murder if It's for a cause but should you?

I agree with you. I'm a man of peace. As I said previously, I disagree with both parties, and their roles in this tragedy.
All I'm saying is that the outcry/outrage should be equally (at least) directed at all of them, and not just the grooms.

One should also bear in mind that the ability to conduct oneself in a rationale manner comes with its limitations as well. Speak to the Senekal farmers. Again, not condoning any violence...just reminding everyone of perspective.

CODESA - That is the solution and the reason South Africa is in such turmoil now is that the principles of this meeting are not followed - We need a permanent CODESA instead of a parliment that is an embarrassment to the world with at least the big three parties often acting like brainless toddlers instead of beacons of hope -

I warned a few prominent leaders in Racing(RA board members) that restoring the dignity of Grooms should be first priority -I was ignored - That was about 12 or so years ago and now look at the disaster we have . I was thinking say for example a groom is really tops at his job but decides that he wants to immigrate to give his children a better life(say he wants to move to the UK) - Now when applying for a work visa what does he do? Send in a video of him receiving a R1000 cheque for his horse winning a race or better still preset a beer mug he got when his charge won a Grade 1? He has no paper qualification unlike jockeys trainers and assistants who all have to pass an exam with the NHRA - Why is that? You have the Maree workriders School - Why is it not compulsory for ALL grooms to pass that course and get accreditation - I already hear them say - "they are illiterate" - well you can get a driver's license even if you are illiterate so considering that looking after a horse is 99% manual labour then that should be a given.

.....Mr H this is also my major beef with the industry....shambolic....so much for the creation of the The Racing Trust and the transformation or up liftment it was supposed to bring about.....it is a disgrace.....

www.news24.com/news24/southafrica/news/p...-rules-ccma-20201130