Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

the hawk
Senior Member
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

Okay so here is NOT my final response as I am investigating further.

The trainer did nothing wrong - he DID phone in time to change from racing unshod to racing with shoes in time. He did not declare shoes at the time of declarations and the system "pulled up" unshod, as that is how the horse had run in its previous two starts - but as mentioned the trainer phoned in time to make the change.

So yes, the fault lies with the NRB although the audit trail appears to reveal that the Agent did in fact make the change but for some reason or another the "system" (and I am certainly no IT guy) did not capture it properly and transfer the information to "Race Card Changes". That part is still being investigated by the IT Team.

As Tony mentioned, we can not unscramble the egg but we can certainly try and make good with the owner who is hereby invited to contact me directly via email on graemeh@goldcircle.co.za.

Obviously we also want to ensure that this sort of thing does not happen again. I can assure everyone that was no devious plot to engineer the scratching of the horse.

Kind regards

Graeme.

The following user(s) said Thank You: Dave Scott, Sylvester, naresh, Craig Eudey, Zietsman Oosthuizen, kt6747, Sharky

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Sharky
Premium Member
Posts: 543
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769310

A welcomed and refreshing post. Pity about the incident but if this is the new attitude, there is a lot to look forward to. Well done Hawkins, leading by example. Here’s to a more positive racing season.

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Sammy Silver
Platinum Member
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Thanks: 1079

Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769311

the hawk wrote: Okay so here is NOT my final response as I am investigating further.

The trainer did nothing wrong - he DID phone in time to change from racing unshod to racing with shoes in time. He did not declare shoes at the time of declarations and the system "pulled up" unshod, as that is how the horse had run in its previous two starts - but as mentioned the trainer phoned in time to make the change.

So yes, the fault lies with the NRB although the audit trail appears to reveal that the Agent did in fact make the change but for some reason or another the "system" (and I am certainly no IT guy) did not capture it properly and transfer the information to "Race Card Changes". That part is still being investigated by the IT Team.

As Tony mentioned, we can not unscramble the egg but we can certainly try and make good with the owner who is hereby invited to contact me directly via email on graemeh@goldcircle.co.za.

Obviously we also want to ensure that this sort of thing does not happen again. I can assure everyone that was no devious plot to engineer the scratching of the horse.

Kind regards

Graeme.

You are a legend and the kind of person that racing needs. Phum fell apart when you left!!

The following user(s) said Thank You: Zietsman Oosthuizen

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Over the Air
Platinum Member
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769319

Utter bs that we now think because a mistake is acknowledged that everything will be ok. It's absolutely not ok and I am In Minciones camp here, there needs to be restitution of some sort. Sorry is not good enough particularly if IT is being blamed for clear human error.

I have one question - why could this not have been sorted out between the trainer and the stipes? It seems that a call to the NRB would have revealed that the trainer was not at fault. Bottom line - why should the owner have paid the price for a bureaucratic bungle?

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Zietsman Oosthuizen
Platinum Member
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769342

THE HAWK salute for your effort and engaging problems and trying to help.
You correct in every sense and racing needs you now more than ever

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the good
Premium Member
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769359

Thats why Graeme has always been proactive in this business.

The sad fact is the stipes change decisions at their discretion. In this instance their discretion should have been to allow the horse to run with shoes.

The whole operation needs a shake down.

There are people in the important racing positions that have other jobs which they moonlight. Its unacceptable that these mistakes are constantly made.

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Craig Eudey
Platinum Member
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769373

My 2 cents worth. I gather that firstly the stipes say that it is the responsibility of the trainer to check. If you do a change online(if I remember correctly) it tells you to check it has gone through. The problem was that if they had allowed the horse to run with punters not having been properly informed and by chance it had won, there would be a huge outcry from those who did not know of the change from no shoes to alumites. Knowing the change would probably have influenced their bets.

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Tony Mincione
Junior Member
Posts: 80
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769385

the good wrote: Thats why Graeme has always been proactive in this business.

The sad fact is the stipes change decisions at their discretion. In this instance their discretion should have been to allow the horse to run with shoes.
.

I support people who have put in the time and care for the game.

Unfortunately, the horse could never have been allowed to run with shoes once publicly committed without shoes. We can never go bending rules to suit this or that individual. It would be hundreds of times worse than what happened to these innocent connections. Change the rule and then okay. But the rules are there to protect the public and everyone else, including the other owners in that race and everyone's bets.

For instance, what if your opinion is that this horse is an iffy mover needs shoes to win and you are waiting for her to run in shoes. Each time you check the card and then the card changes. So you leave it out, and it wins and suddenly shoes "appeared" mid-racemeeting?

Horseracing is a game of strategy and information, a sort of chess game with real pieces and real costs and consequences. We offer the public something special in horseracing, not the clickbait that is casino gaming.

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the good
Premium Member
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769392

Always the" what if the horse wins "

Here is my take. The change will be made at least 30 min before the start, so most punters will know of the change and factor it into their bets or change their bets.
Almost all these problems are because the NRB have made a mistake and they should be properly censured.

Why should the Owner who has spent Thousands of Rand every month keeping the horse and more buying it be inconvenienced by shoddy work.
Lets face it the owner is THE most important person in the cog of racing.
I am an Owner supporter and the rest of the racing personnel make a living out of owners buying and keeping horses. All employees are there because of owners. Punters are given the opportunity to bet because owners buy and keep horses.
And the punter MIGHT loose once because an employee makes a mistake but the owner looses every time.

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Tony Mincione
Junior Member
Posts: 80
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769395

Every single decision in racing that got us here, has been made by colour holders.

You cannot have owners being put first, not if you want non-owners to support the game. Trainers and breeders, you put the owner first because they are your customer.

But the owners are NOT the customer of the game. That thinking has got you changing the rules as horses are circling in the parade ring, and racing looking down the barrel of bankruptcy.

In my humble opinion, of course.

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MissT
Premium Member
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Re: Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769434

Tony and The Good whilst I do agree with all you say I do not think you can put one in front of the other in terms of importance. Let's be honest you say punters would not be able to punt if owners didn't buy horses but that's the cart before the horse to be honest. I'm pretty sure without stakes generated by punters owners would not be buying or racing horses for cups or glory. Put the customer first and look after them and as the stakes grow the owners will increase . But all this aside if nothing changes then nothing will change and seriously most of the current gang need to be replaced in order for racing to move forward positively.

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Mac
Platinum Member
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Re: Re:Racing Bureau/ Gold Circle can’t give answers.

5 years 9 months ago

#769472

Officialdom is now too scared to make extraordinary racecard changes since the discipline dished out from Hong Kong over some unannounced jockey change or something.

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