HANDICAPPING DEBATE - KAREL AND LOUISG

So Karel Miedema is "sick" of my "rants" against the handicappers. Obviously he believes that I have no substance in or to my statements or even that I don't understand handicapping or even , perhaps, that I am a bit "thick" , for want of a better description . After all, that's the easiest way out, for the supporters of the MR system, as applied by the handicappers at present. Just call the Trainers (the vast majority of them who are unhappy with the system), thick.

There will be no prizes for remembering that these are the same bunch of handicapppers who stuffed up badly when they raised the turf population's ratings by 6 points last year and were later forced to rectify their massive stuff up, by having to rectify the problem, by dropping same population by 6 points again, after some months. And on the subject of remembering things, we all remember the age old saying about hell and fury and a woman scorned....and we see now, how horses are being punished....since the handicappers were forced by the industry, to rectify their poor judgement.

I may have a lot to learn about handicapping. Karel may reveal my weak points in this regard. And I will be man enough to take it. That I promise you. However, I trust that common sense and the wellbeing of the Industry will be the goal.

So, I challenge Karel to a debate on handicapping, if Hibs and Scotia allow. The following rules apply-

RULES

1)ONLY Karel and myself are allowed to post on this thread, for the duration of the debate.
2)Forumites participation is great and comments on the adjoining thread, entitled , " FORUMITES RESPOND HANDICAPPING DEBATE"
3)The reasons for 1 and 2 above are simply to allow us to focus on the points.
4) I will lead the debate, by making a statement. Under that statement, I will make some points and then Karel can respond. We both have a chance to come back, after which that point is closed. We then move onto my next point.

Karel, will you participate ??

Louis you are the best placer of horses I have ever seen, it will be no debate my bud sorry.

Hi Louis,

Bit tardy in replying, as I'm under the whip with some nasty deadlines.
Yes, of course we'll do this.
Maybe debate is not a right word, rather than meeting of minds.
There's a lot to learn for all of us.

If we want to make this meaningful for everyone who reads it, I suggest I gather some very basic information on the subject. I've written quite a few things in the past, to explain how handicapping works. Just need to delve around a bit.

That way we'll have sketched a background, and it'll be easier for everyone to understand the questions.
Maybe it should center on:
-How does the system work and what is it supposed to achieve?
-Does the system work – and if not, why not, and what could be a solution?

Let's deal with generalities first, specifics can come later, if at all.

You suggested this would just be between the two of us.
Can I make a counter suggestion, to extend the panel to (say) four?
I certainly can do with some help.

I'll let you know when I've found what I'd like to put up as background for everyone.
Give me a day or so.

Very constructive reply and we have a wealth of knowledge on the site with Jack, JAP, Frodo, Rob etc

OK, no problem. You guys run with it then, Dave.

? Louis , Karel suggested a panel of 4 which sounds reasonable

As I said, no problem. Open another thread. All good then.

Dave, a simple debate between Karel and myself also sounds reasonable. Comments on the other thread. Simple.
Now all you have to do is agree with that. Why complicate ?

And on those terms I am in.

No complications from my side
You did a post Karel responded and made a suggestion of 4
If Karel is happy with just you both please carry on

All fine with me.
I'll start a new thread to open with the background info, to keep things in focus.