so who is lying ..brugman or woodruf assistant

I would stay out of the race if their are first timers,nobody can predict how a horse will perform for first time in a race,no matter how good work it puts up at home.Of course there are exceptions but they are few and far between.Rather let it run and then make an assessment.

bush answer the question that started the thread..this crickets exciting

but what if its in the place accumalator or you want to take a quartet or trifecta

The owner told molly: It will be too short for the horse,but i had a bet and we expect a good run from it,no misleading?

did youn hear what the assistant trainer said on uso

nope,i dont look those crap

Pirates

I believe firmly that the first timer rule for the pick six should also apply for the place accumlator,the first three horses past the post that have run before should qualify.

agreed 100 percent

i have horses in the woodruff stable if you listen to assistant trainers in that yard you will be sinking down the river vaal at a fast rate.

Hence my horse Captain lance i been told week in week out cant lose.

Escbar won the ideathe message was needs the run from the yard so maybe they dont know.

when last was a woodruff 1st timer punted loghts ut that actually arrived other than rock concert last few years very bad recorrd.

If under starters orders ask any of my trainers about m y 1st timers they should be told by the trainer its not your buisness whether fancied or not.

2nd when telly track pay appearance money to my trainer then i can divulge that info as maybe i will pay less keep.

amyway the teletrack presenter should not embarass themselves.

Barry Irwin is 1 million % correct. Bookmakers is the cause of most of the trouble. As for the takeout of up to 25%, please remember that the takeout fund the total racing operation in SA. Bookmakers probably take 75% of the bets, most of it under the table, without anything being ploughed back into the racing game. If only the tote existed this takeout will be considerably lower %, on much, much higher pools. It is a complicated subject, but Barry is right.

I strongly disagree sharkie, the tote has the monolopy on exoctics, punters need choice, fixed odds being a vital one. For the stakes pot, levy everyone on turnover and level the playing field. Let bookmakers market their offering via sponsorship and there is extra for the stakes pot their too.

A tote monolopy on win and place bets would be draconian and a disaster.

The statement was/is,
"on uso woodruf assistant says far to short for cradock and will be overjoyed for a place...mollet says that brugman says they fancy it strongly and they having a bet..lets see".

The trainer acts as the agent for the owner. It is up to the owner if he wishes the trainer to divulge any info on his horse. Some owners would like a punt on their 1st-timers, others dont.
However, for the trainer to say its too short and just before the off the owner, who is a RA director, to take the extraordinary step of phoning Molly, contradict the trainer and state they fancy it strong, have had the punt so get on, is mind-boggling.
This shortly after the RA's, 'You be the Judge", where this issue was discussed.
This is not transparency but an attempt to fix the trainers statement.
Imagine catsmug or oscar phoning Tellytrack just before the off, they would be ignored. But it was one of the big boys, and Molly and Clyde were falling over each to sing the praises of this director's transparency.

Give us a break !

The debate of the owners' 'right' to get on first will probably be argued to eternity but this sort of thing cannot be condoned and the perpetrators must explain themselves.